It is called "hormesis," and if this scientific theory is proved valid it
could be the most important environmental event of the 21st century. Billions of
dollars could be saved in environmental cleanup costs, say researchers, while at
the same time improving the health of all organisms, including humans. But at
first examination, hormesis appears kooky. The knee-jerk reaction is to reject
this phenomenon as pseudoscience or propaganda by polluters, and a few
uninformed observers have done just that.
But hormesis is a possible, if not highly probable, iconoclastic notion, first
postulated either in the 16th century or the 1880s but gaining flattering
attention within the last decade, that humans actually need small amounts of
poison in their diets. A little arsenic, dioxin or radiation peppered on the
spaghetti sauce may be just what we require to live long and healthy lives. And
since humans need more toxins in our environment than allowed under current
government regulations, so the theory goes, future efforts to clean up the
environment could be greatly reduced.
The idea is that poisons such as arsenic are, of course, poisonous - that is, if
one ingests too much they will produce sickness or death. But arsenic and other
toxins in very low doses, below an amount deemed harmful, repeatedly have been
shown to benefit the functions of organs, the optimal growth of the organism or
longevity. According to scientists who favor this theory, when the human body,
or cell, becomes stressed or damaged by a small amount of poison, it not only
repairs the damage but overcompensates and becomes stronger than it was. The
phenomenon is similar to exercise; by jogging or lifting weights, one may
stretch and exhaust the muscle tissue, which causes soreness. But later the
muscle not only repairs itself but overcompensates and improves to the point
where one can lift more weight or run longer and faster.
Chon Shoaf, a scientist with the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) at
Research Triangle Park, N.C., says recent work on hormesis "is revolutionary and
we want people to be aware of it. It has the potential to generate substantial
savings."
The persons most responsible for conceptualizing and exalting this pioneering
research since the 1990s, and who may flip EPA policy upside down to the benefit
of taxpayers and every organism down to the last menacing insect, is Edward
Calabrese, 56, a toxicology professor at the University of Massachusetts at
Amherst, and his longtime assistant Linda Baldwin. He has been described as "one
of the leading toxicologists in the country." Speaking to Insight in his messy
office, whose floor for the last three years has featured what appears to be the
largest malfunctioning air conditioner ever seen on planet Earth, Calabrese
explains his breakthrough research. These are ideas, ironically, that were
generated not by an elite Massachusetts university with posh paraphernalia on
the banks of the Charles River, but rather from the "70 to 80 hours weekly" this
scientist toils at his lunch-pail university that the elitists sometimes refer
to as "Zoo Mass."
"I believe there is not a single chemical that does not" exhibit patterns of
hormesis, Calabrese says. It is a general response that is shown with mercury,
lead, components of cigarette smoke, cadmium, marijuana, cocaine, alcohol and
"everything that is regulated by the EPA."
One example is the first time Calabrese witnessed hormesis as an undergraduate
student at Bridgewater State College in Massachusetts in 1966. He had been
assigned to retard the growth of peppermint plants with high doses of a
growth-retardant chemical. Not only did the plants not die, they grew taller
than normal - a result, Calabrese says, that comes from mistakenly treating the
plants with what proved to be too little growth-retardant.
The policy implication for this work, if proved valid, is stratospheric. It
means the EPA could permit higher concentrations of so-called toxins in the
environment, actually encouraging healthier lives and simultaneously saving
money by not cleaning "toxic" sites. After all, the EPA now assumes the optimal
level for a vast majority of carcinogens is zero parts per billion - in other
words, none at all.
What makes the work of Calabrese and Baldwin especially credible as these things
go is that their research is not uniquely their own, but an analysis of
thousands of toxicology studies done by others the world over. "We evaluated
about 21,000 cases, using 2 percent on which the data were most complete,"
Calabrese says. "Of those 2 percent, 40 percent showed hormesis." Most
toxicology studies are not helpful in analyzing for hormesis because the doses
of toxins used are too high since researchers are studying a poison's threshold
of lethality and not its potential beneficial properties. According to
Calabrese, "The model showing hormesis has a huge amount of data, more than any
other competing model. This is so overwhelmingly convincing I do not think
anyone rational could deny that hormesis exists."
That said, another reason scientists are taking the work of Calabrese so
seriously is the environmental cleanup and expense implications of work he has
done in the past. At one point his studies drew the wrath of the chemical
industry, the same circle now delighting in his conclusions on hormesis. This
Massachusetts scientist was in fact the primary proponent of the
"single-exposure carcinogen theory," which says that humans sometimes can
contract cancer with just one exposure to a carcinogen, a theory with the
potential to add millions to the cost of chemical manufacturing. It also was
virtually his testimony alone in the 1990s that forced the government to spend
millions of additional dollars cleaning a toxic site in Colorado to a much
higher standard than previously expected, and contrary to the testimony of
others and at least one irate newspaper.
"I am nonideological," Calabrese says. "But my work on hormesis is a little like
President [Richard] Nixon going to China."
Calabrese is the first to say more research needs to be done "before we start
handing out radiation pills," though some researchers seem more cautious.
Nonetheless, this reporter was unable to find any toxicologist who substantially
disagreed with Calabrese's work on hormesis, including officials at the Sierra
Club, a prominent environmental advocacy group.
At the same time, "There are trade-offs in hormesis that we cannot forget
about," warns Michael Davis, an EPA scientist also in North Carolina. "I do not
believe all organisms share the same mechanical basis of hormesis. I see it as a
variety of things." Thus, each poison must be evaluated separately because each
particular toxin may affect different parts of an organism differently. For
example, a toxin at low doses may help a person grow taller, but also damage his
liver. Another difficulty is the possibility that a particular poison at a
certain dose may help one individual, yet hurt another, Davis says. "But I am
not ruling out that hormesis could have significant EPA policy implications."
According to Calabrese, hormesis also has an ugly side for some drugs prescribed
by physicians. It means some pharmaceuticals that might cure a sickness at high
doses could hurt at low doses. "The effects flip," he says. "So I want my doctor
to know about hormesis, though unfortunately most are unaware of it."
One who apparently did not know about hormesis, or at least whose office refused
to respond to repeated messages about it, was recently resigned EPA
administrator Christine Todd Whitman, who would not comment even on the work of
her own people on this matter.
"The EPA does not want the American people to become cognizant of good
environmental news, or potential savings in environmental cleanup, because in
part they view the agency as a jobs program," says a scientist who often engages
the EPA. "If the American people realize the environment is getting cleaner and
healthier, they might seek to cut the funding of the EPA because much of its
purpose has been accomplished. They seem to be afraid of losing their jobs."
Although properties of hormesis have been documented for many years, Calabrese
says there are several reasons why it took the scientific community so long to
examine hormesis and his research about it seriously. The EPA controls a large
part of the funding, and therefore how the research is conducted, he says. Since
the government is interested in saving lives, the research it funds in this area
is almost always to study a toxin's lethal effect, as opposed to its beneficial
side, so the research is not generated.
In addition, the beneficial effects of a poison tend to be less dramatic than
its deadly results, he says, so it is less noticeable. It may benefit a plant in
small amounts by only 30 percent, but in larger doses its pernicious effect may
be a factor of 10 times. Scientists also often will see a benefit of only 1
percent of the time in a study because most of the research involves much higher
doses, and "they blow it off," Calabrese says. "They think it is a freak thing.
They have to learn to think out[side] of the box."
But thanks in part to Calabrese and Baldwin, that box now has been broken wide
open and good news is spilling all over the ground. It is a toxic spill with
which we all can learn to live.
John Pike is a contributing writer to Insight magazine.
All comments generated by this article that I could find.
Theory of Hormesis Could Save Homeowners a Bundle
Thank you for John Pike's excellent article on hormesis ["Can
Toxins Lead to Healthier Lives?" Jan. 6-19]. I first became aware of this
theory in the context of the debate about radon. Insight's readers might like to
check out a number of articles about radon hormesis at the Doctors for Disaster
Preparedness Website (www.oism.org/ddp/lowdose.htm).
With the amount of money being mandated for radon remediation, new standards
based on a recognition of hormesis could save homeowners in my area a
considerable expense.
J. Keen Holland
Lenhartsville, Pa.
Dear Mr. Pike,
*
Your Recent
article on hormesis was thought-provoking.* You may wish to follow up with the
prof at U-Pittsburg who has advocated radiation hormesis for a number of years.*
His radiation studies could save municipalities billions of dollars; many cities
are being forced to reduce radiation content in drinking water.* But this same
radiation content often attracted thousands to medicinal baths early in this
century.
"Calabrese is the first to say more research needs to be done
"before we start handing out radiation pills," though some researchers seem more
cautious. Nonetheless, this reporter was unable to find any toxicologist who
substantially disagreed with Calabrese's work on hormesis, including officials
at the Sierra Club, a prominent environmental advocacy group."
I come to this subject with a bias--as a fan of "pseudoscience or
propaganda by polluters"--so this (from Insight magazine,
via WND)
thrills me:
"According to the theory, a little arsenic, dioxin or radiation peppered on
the spaghetti sauce may be just what we require to live long and healthy
lives...
"The idea is that poisons such as arsenic are, of course, poisonous – that
is, if one ingests too much they will produce sickness or death. But arsenic
and other toxins in very low doses, below an amount deemed harmful, repeatedly
have been shown to benefit the functions of organs, the optimal growth of the
organism or longevity.
"According to scientists who favor this theory, when the human body, or
cell, becomes stressed or damaged by a small amount of poison, it not only
repairs the damage but overcompensates and becomes stronger than it was."
Wahoo! More poison, less EPA. Bring it on.
posted by eliana on 01.03.04 at 07:23 AM
Comments:
Just what are they teaching you guys over in New Haven, anyway? First Pat
Roberson, then Bush, now the Diva ...
I come to this subject with a bias--as a fan of "pseudoscience or
propaganda by polluters"--so this (from Insight magazine,
via WND)
thrills me:
"According to the theory, a little arsenic, dioxin or radiation peppered
on the spaghetti sauce may be just what we require to live long and healthy
lives...
"The idea is that poisons such as arsenic are, of course, poisonous –
that is, if one ingests too much they will produce sickness or death. But
arsenic and other toxins in very low doses, below an amount deemed harmful,
repeatedly have been shown to benefit the functions of organs, the optimal
growth of the organism or longevity.
"According to scientists who favor this theory, when the human body, or
cell, becomes stressed or damaged by a small amount of poison, it not only
repairs the damage but overcompensates and becomes stronger than it was."
Wahoo! More poison, less EPA. Bring it on.
posted by eliana on 01.03.04 at 07:23 AM
Comments:
Just what are they teaching you guys over in New Haven, anyway? First Pat
Roberson, then Bush, now the Diva ...
Well, as I have been personnaly cured, fifteen years ago, with arsenic, I
can say that arsenic is not always a poison.
It is the same with many medecines your doctor give you : if taken in a high
dose they can kill you, if taken in an appropriate dose it can save you
life.
Radiations works the same way.
Jean-Claude
what do you think of physicians when they prescribe low dosages of
methotrexate for various diseases such as rheumatoid arthritis? this is a
chemo drug given in low doses and physicians who write out the
prescriptions. what do you think of that? i would like to think there might
be a small bit of hope in the possiblity of hormesis. There is a place
called Merry Widow Mine (article written in Nat'l Geographic) in Basin,
Montana that claims they have people who come to there mine on a regular
basis just for the healing effects. Could it be true or just another money
maker? who knows
News From Babylon :
NFB Homepage ... Propaganda by JohnPike, WorldNet
Daily [US] January 3rd, 2003 'Revolutionary'
research suggests billions can be saved in cleanup costs Hormesis, the
...
www.newsfrombabylon.com/index.php - 101k -
Cached -
Similar pages
by John Pike, WorldNet
Daily [US]
January 3rd, 2004
'Revolutionary' research suggests billions can be saved in
cleanup costs
Hormesis, the scientific theory that humans actually need small
amounts of poison in their diets, could be the most important
environmental event of the 21st century if proved valid. Billions of
dollars could be saved in environmental cleanup costs, say
researchers, while at the same time improving the health of all
organisms, including humans.
But at first examination, hormesis appears kooky. The
knee-jerk reaction is to reject this phenomenon as pseudoscience or
propaganda by polluters, and a few uninformed observers have done
just that.
-----------------------------------------------
Submitted by
sv3n, posted by
JohnBrown on Saturday, January 03 @ 17:16:10 EST (125 reads)
(Read
More... | 10142 bytes more | |
1
comment |
)
Topic: Hormesis: Can Toxins Lead to Healthier Lives?
lockjaw02
Member
posted 01-03-2004 10:57
PM
Edward Calabrese, 56, a toxicology
professor at the University of Massachusetts at Amherst, is apparently a
reformed believer in hormesis. According to
this article Calabrese was the guy who costs industry millions in
environmental cleanup expenses from his previous work and was the primary
proponent of the "single-exposure carcinogen theory".
quote:
"I believe there is not a single
chemical that does not" exhibit patterns of hormesis, Calabrese says. It
is a general response that is shown with mercury, lead, components of
cigarette smoke, cadmium, marijuana, cocaine, alcohol and "everything that
is regulated by the EPA."
One example is the first time
Calabrese witnessed hormesis as an undergraduate student at Bridgewater
State College in Massachusetts in 1966. He had been assigned to retard the
growth of peppermint plants with high doses of a growth-retardant
chemical. Not only did the plants not die, they grew taller than normal -
a result, Calabrese says, that comes from mistakenly treating the plants
with what proved to be too little growth-retardant.
Wonder what this will do to
environmental tobacco smoke theories.
Originally posted by lockjaw02: Since this topic generated so much interest, figured you might like to
see the full text,
Hormesis as a Biological Hypothesis, at nih.gov.
Not read the article fully yet but I
was suddenly reminded of experiences with anti-ant products. The powders
seem to work OK of spread around but only prevent not 'cure'. The 'get them
to to take the poison back to the nest and kill the others' approach seems
to fail woefully.
All the times I persevered with that
approach just resulted in more and more ants.
Maybe the manufacturer's instruction
to use just a few drops was more for marketing benefit (repeat sales
potential) than for true purpose. Perhaps I should have used several gallons
rather than a few drops?
Calabrese has also published on radiation hormesis. I had some
discussions with Petr Beckmann on this subject during the 80's and early
90's, prior to his death. Have also attended presentations at DDP meetings.
Googling today gets 2380 hits for radiation hormesis but only 488 for
chemical hormesis. There are also a few hormesis posts in our archives. My
interest in this subject has to do with having had considerable radiation
exposure over the years, as a child and occupationally.
Copyright Restrictions: You should know the drill by now. If you post
it here, then you promise that you have the right to do so and pledge to
defend and hold harmless this board and the staff which manages daily
operations.
The staff reserves the right to edit or delete material you submit if, in its
judgment, your claim is not reasonable.
Friends,
Ed Calabrese's work is very positively reported, disparaging persons
who question the effects, by Dr. John Pike. Dr. Pike has a very high
profile and is a widely quoted spokesperson on science, especially space
and security. He was a national spokesman for 20 years with the
Federation of American Scientists.
Please forward this to your science and industry associates, to your
contacts in policy and media, and to family and friends, preferably with
your own comments and support to continuing the effort to document the
science. (And to disparage the naysayers? :-)
Thank you. And have a Happy New Year!
Regards, Jim Muckerheide
========================
Hormesis, the scientific theory that humans actually need small amounts of
poison in their diets, could be the most important environmental event of the
21st century if proved valid. Billions of dollars could be saved in
environmental cleanup costs, say researchers, while at the same time improving
the health of all organisms, including humans.
But at first examination, hormesis appears kooky. The knee-jerk reaction is
to reject this phenomenon as pseudoscience or propaganda by polluters, and a few
uninformed observers have done just that.
But hormesis is a possible, if not highly probable, iconoclastic notion,
first postulated either in the 16th century or the 1880s but gaining flattering
attention within the last decade.
According to the theory, a little arsenic, dioxin or radiation peppered on
the spaghetti sauce may be just what we require to live long and healthy lives.
And since humans need more toxins in our environment than allowed under current
government regulations, so the theory goes, future efforts to clean up the
environment could be greatly reduced.
The idea is that poisons such as arsenic are, of course, poisonous – that is,
if one ingests too much they will produce sickness or death. But arsenic and
other toxins in very low doses, below an amount deemed harmful, repeatedly have
been shown to benefit the functions of organs, the optimal growth of the
organism or longevity.
According to scientists who favor this theory, when the human body, or cell,
becomes stressed or damaged by a small amount of poison, it not only repairs the
damage but overcompensates and becomes stronger than it was. The phenomenon is
similar to exercise; by jogging or lifting weights, one may stretch and exhaust
the muscle tissue, which causes soreness. But later the muscle not only repairs
itself but overcompensates and improves to the point where one can lift more
weight or run longer and faster.
Chon Shoaf, a scientist with the Environmental Protection Agency, or EPA, at
Research Triangle Park, N.C., says recent work on hormesis "is revolutionary and
we want people to be aware of it. It has the potential to generate substantial
savings."
The persons most responsible for conceptualizing and exalting this pioneering
research since the 1990s, and who may flip EPA policy upside down to the benefit
of taxpayers and every organism down to the last menacing insect, is Edward
Calabrese, 56, a toxicology professor at the University of Massachusetts at
Amherst, and his longtime assistant Linda Baldwin. He has been described as "one
of the leading toxicologists in the country." Speaking to Insight in his messy
office, whose floor for the last three years has featured what appears to be the
largest malfunctioning air conditioner ever seen on planet Earth, Calabrese
explains his breakthrough research. These are ideas, ironically, that were
generated not by an elite Massachusetts university with posh paraphernalia on
the banks of the Charles River, but rather from the "70 to 80 hours weekly" this
scientist toils at his lunch-pail university that the elitists sometimes refer
to as "Zoo Mass."
"I believe there is not a single chemical that does not" exhibit patterns of
hormesis, Calabrese says. It is a general response that is shown with mercury,
lead, components of cigarette smoke, cadmium, marijuana, cocaine, alcohol and
"everything that is regulated by the EPA."
One example is the first time Calabrese witnessed hormesis as an
undergraduate student at Bridgewater State College in Massachusetts in 1966. He
had been assigned to retard the growth of peppermint plants with high doses of a
growth-retardant chemical. Not only did the plants not die, they grew taller
than normal – a result, Calabrese says, that comes from mistakenly treating the
plants with what proved to be too little growth-retardant.
The policy implication for this work, if proved valid, is stratospheric. It
means the EPA could permit higher concentrations of so-called toxins in the
environment, actually encouraging healthier lives and simultaneously saving
money by not cleaning "toxic" sites. After all, the EPA now assumes the optimal
level for a vast majority of carcinogens is zero parts per billion – in other
words, none at all.
What makes the work of Calabrese and Baldwin especially credible as these
things go is that their research is not uniquely their own, but an analysis of
thousands of toxicology studies done by others the world over.
"We evaluated about 21,000 cases, using 2 percent on which the data were most
complete," Calabrese says. "Of those 2 percent, 40 percent showed hormesis."
Most toxicology studies are not helpful in analyzing for hormesis because the
doses of toxins used are too high since researchers are studying a poison's
threshold of lethality and not its potential beneficial properties. According to
Calabrese, "The model showing hormesis has a huge amount of data, more than any
other competing model. This is so overwhelmingly convincing I do not think
anyone rational could deny that hormesis exists."
That said, another reason scientists are taking the work of Calabrese so
seriously is the environmental cleanup and expense implications of work he has
done in the past. At one point his studies drew the wrath of the chemical
industry, the same circle now delighting in his conclusions on hormesis.
This Massachusetts scientist was in fact the primary proponent of the
"single-exposure carcinogen theory," which says that humans sometimes can
contract cancer with just one exposure to a carcinogen, a theory with the
potential to add millions to the cost of chemical manufacturing.
It also was virtually his testimony alone in the 1990s that forced the
government to spend millions of additional dollars cleaning a toxic site in
Colorado to a much higher standard than previously expected, and contrary to the
testimony of others and at least one irate newspaper.
"I am nonideological," Calabrese says. "But my work on hormesis is a little
like President [Richard] Nixon going to China."
Calabrese is the first to say more research needs to be done "before we start
handing out radiation pills," though some researchers seem more cautious.
Nonetheless, this reporter was unable to find any toxicologist who substantially
disagreed with Calabrese's work on hormesis, including officials at the Sierra
Club, a prominent environmental advocacy group.
At the same time, "There are trade-offs in hormesis that we cannot forget
about," warns Michael Davis, an EPA scientist also in North Carolina. "I do not
believe all organisms share the same mechanical basis of hormesis. I see it as a
variety of things." Thus, each poison must be evaluated separately because each
particular toxin may affect different parts of an organism differently.
For example, a toxin at low doses may help a person grow taller, but also
damage his liver. Another difficulty is the possibility that a particular poison
at a certain dose may help one individual, yet hurt another.
"But I am not ruling out that hormesis could have significant EPA policy
implications," says Davis.
According to Calabrese, hormesis also has an ugly side for some drugs
prescribed by physicians. It means some pharmaceuticals that might cure a
sickness at high doses could hurt at low doses. "The effects flip," he says. "So
I want my doctor to know about hormesis, though unfortunately most are unaware
of it."
One who apparently did not know about hormesis, or at least whose office
refused to respond to repeated messages about it, was recently resigned EPA
administrator Christine Todd Whitman, who would not comment even on the work of
her own people on this matter.
"The EPA does not want the American people to become cognizant of good
environmental news, or potential savings in environmental cleanup, because in
part they view the agency as a jobs program," says a scientist who often engages
the EPA. "If the American people realize the environment is getting cleaner and
healthier, they might seek to cut the funding of the EPA because much of its
purpose has been accomplished. They seem to be afraid of losing their jobs."
Although properties of hormesis have been documented for many years,
Calabrese says there are several reasons why it took the scientific community so
long to examine hormesis and his research about it seriously. The EPA controls a
large part of the funding, and therefore how the research is conducted, he says.
Since the government is interested in saving lives, the research it funds in
this area is almost always to study a toxin's lethal effect, as opposed to its
beneficial side, so the research is not generated.
In addition, the beneficial effects of a poison tend to be less dramatic than
its deadly results, he says, so it is less noticeable. It may benefit a plant in
small amounts by only 30 percent, but in larger doses its pernicious effect may
be a factor of 10 times. Scientists also often will see a benefit of only 1
percent of the time in a study because most of the research involves much higher
doses, and "they blow it off," according to Calabrese.
"They think it is a freak thing. They have to learn to think out[side] of the
box," he says.
But thanks in part to Calabrese and Baldwin, that box now has been broken
wide open and good news is spilling all over the ground. It is a toxic spill
with which we all can learn to live.
"The EPA does not want the American people to become cognizant of good
environmental news, or potential savings in environmental cleanup, because in
part they view the agency as a jobs program," says a scientist who often
engages the EPA. "If the American people realize the environment is getting
cleaner and healthier, they might seek to cut the funding of the EPA because
much of its purpose has been accomplished. They seem to be afraid of losing
their jobs."
Well, DUH!!!
The EPA IS nothing more than a government bureaucracy.
All bureaucracies are metastasized cancers whose sole purpose is to consume
resources and grow larger.
7
posted on 01/03/2004 8:33:28 AM PST by
E.
Pluribus Unum (Drug prohibition laws help fund terrorism.)
The most fastidious clean careful people that I have met are also the sickest!
I have consumed huge amounts of asbestos, lead (siphoning gas, chewing it for
gum, breathing lead oxide and paint, sanding body lead before bondo, etc.),
trichlorethlene, and the vapors from spraying around 1000 gal. of paint
yearly, dust from construction and anything else you might think of including
DDT which I love the smell of and i've smoked since I was 11.
It's now been 57 years since i've been sick, had the measles when I was 8, and
have never had the flu.
8
posted on 01/03/2004 8:50:56 AM PST by
dalereed
(,)
To: JohnHuang2; *puff_list; Just another Joe; SheLion; Max McGarrity;
Conspiracy Guy; metesky; ...
The EPA controls a large part of the funding, and therefore how the
research is conducted, he says. Since the government is interested in saving
lives, the research it funds in this area is almost always to study a toxin's
lethal effect, as opposed to its beneficial side, so the research is not
generated.
It seems we're not the only ones who have been saying the same thing for
quite some time!!!
10
posted on 01/03/2004 9:25:28 AM PST by
Gabz
(smoke gnatzies - small minds buzzing in your business -swat'em)
"The EPA does not want the American people to become cognizant of good
environmental news, or potential savings in environmental cleanup, because in
part they view the agency as a jobs program," It isn't just the EPA,
it's all government agencies!
12
posted on 01/03/2004 9:28:24 AM PST by
dalereed
(,)
I've smoked cigarettes since I was 11 and breathed DDT daily during the summer
in the 40s and early 50s spraying the back patio where we cooked and ate
dinner most evenings.
Sorry for the bad grammar in the prior post.
16
posted on 01/03/2004 9:42:07 AM PST by
dalereed
(,)
For almost a year when she was two, my daughter had severe exzema, with
only the soles of her feet and her scalp clear. We had to tie socks on her
hands to keep her from clawing herself bloody. It got to where almost all my
wife could do was rock her all day long while she cried. (Needless to say, Mom
also almost went crazy.)
We tried every imaginable form of therapy, from
cortisone injections to nutrition to acupuncture. Nothing worked, at all, and
some of the side effects were nasty.
We finally located a homeopath 4 hours away. We drove there, went through
the whole interview process, and he gave her a tiny amount of sulphur. At this
point, she hadn't really slept in two days and nights. Within about 30 seconds
of the sulphur entering her mouth, she went right to sleep. She slept all the
way home and for almost 24 hours straight. When she woke up her eczema was
almost entirely gone, and with one relapse has never come back.
This was over 20 years ago, when homeopathy was almost an underground
movement.
I can't explain these results by standard science. The classic AMA
explanation for the successes of homeopathy is "placebo effect." I defy anyone
to get placebo effect to work on a 2-year old!
17
posted on 01/03/2004 9:45:13 AM PST by
Restorer
I'm glad you got such happy results with homeopathy. It doesn't work for all
but then neither do conventional medicines (drugs) and doctors have no qualms,
no shame in prescribing them anyway on the theory they hopefully they will
work.
18
posted on 01/03/2004 9:51:36 AM PST by
dennisw
(G_d is at war with Amalek for all generations)
My neighbor, who is also my cousin, is absolutely anal about food and
environmental toxins. It's painful to have a meal with her because she talks
non-stop about the "good" and "bad" properties of the food we are eating. I
always find delight in informing her about the latest study that controverts
the conventional "wisdom" that she so stringently lives by.
Oh, and she is a
strict vegetarian who has thyroid, glaucoma, high cholesterol and heart
problems.
To: Gabz; *puff_list; Just another Joe; Great Dane; Max McGarrity;
Tumbleweed_Connection; ...
It seems we're not the only ones who have been saying the same thing for
quite some time!!!
Oh yes! They sure know how to spin it. They don't
want to tell the truth for fear of losing their jobs and/or funding. Just like
the Anti-Tobacco Coalitions.
You got it, Gabz!
What a total waste of tax payers money!
22
posted on 01/03/2004 10:01:04 AM PST by
SheLion
(Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
I consider all the "toxics" and other bad things that I consume and breath to
be immune system stimulants that not only enhance the imune system but keep it
on ready allert!
29
posted on 01/03/2004 10:47:16 AM PST by
dalereed
(,)
I tend to agree with your assessment. Most of the younger people I meet get
ghastly allergic to anything and everything under the sun. A consequence of
too much protection from things in the world when kids are young, I postulate.
Larger issue here is, of course: women. (Dons flame-retardant material).
Ever since they got uppity with this women's lib crap (not to mention getting
the vote), they do what women do: worry and fret and try to keep their kids
safe from anything and everything. I mean, it's a natural instinct, there is
no faulting that. The fault is the excesses this has been carried to through
overempowerment. Oh, and certain geldings like Ralph Nader.
Kids are gonna get sick, skin their knees, break an arm climbing a tree,
run through poison oak. That's what they do. That's what they HAVE to do, and
aren't being allowed to do by a combination of government regulation, state
education, and a de-balled society in general.
There's a whole Taoist discussion that could be brought in here, but
basically, it can be summed as: we've lost our natural balance. If it's not
regained one way, nature has a way of correcting us in another.
31
posted on 01/03/2004 11:00:47 AM PST by
Dr.Deth
I agree with everything you said,we can't hover over kids and expect them to
grow into healthy human beings.
Kids need to explore and experiment,fight with eachother,and yes,get hurt,or
how are they going to get along in the larger world.
I live in a city with neighborhood elementary schools so that kids can
walk,but that's not done anymore. The mothers are there with the SUVs waiting
every day,and the kids never walk to or from school.
Kids need to roll in the dirt more,forget these scheduled "play dates",and
learn to get along without adult supervision.
My sis-in-law is the type who not only doesn't allow smoking in her house, but
also loads her kids up on a pharmacy's worth of medicines, won't have a pet,
and (I'm not joking) literally wipes her kitchen and bathroom down with BLEACH
every time she uses it.
Guess what?
Her kids (and she) are sick ALL THE TIME. They have spent the entire winter
fighting coughs, colds, flus, and other assorted viruses. But they CAN'T fight
them (especially the kids), because she hasn't allowed their little immune
systems to GROW. The instant the children get even the teeniest bit dirty
(like when playing with MY kids, for example), she rushes them off to the
anti-bacterial soap factory that is her bathroom.
She is shocked (SHOCKED, I tell you!) to find that I do not own one single bar
of the nasty orange stuff (Ivory for us, thanks).
Now, while my house isn't dirty, I confess to not being the "I've got to dust,
vacuum and sterilize this place every day" type. Having a sterile house is
fine if you never plan to go OUT, but unless you are a hermit, you will go out
and get exposed to all kinds of nasty little bugs. With no natural immune
system upon which to rely, you may as well be wearing a great big bulls-eye
for the germs on your back.
As far as I'm concerned, the best way to keep everybody healthy is to OPEN THE
DOORS or CRACK THE WINDOWS to let fresh air in.
Sis-in-law insists on an hermetically-sealed house. It's clean, but it smells
like a dentist's office...
As a 71 year old smoker I tend to agree. Kids are sicker now than 30-40
years ago when many of their parents smoked.
I was brought up in the 50's and 60's. ALL THE ADULTS SMOKED! I worked in a
nightclub, where everyone smoked. Other jobs I had.........everyone smoked.
Going out to nightclubs at night with friends, drinking and smoking and NO
smoke eaters!
I could go on and on but you already know what I am going to
say.............there was NO ASTHMA back in those days. NONE. And kids weren't
so sickly either.
The anti's today would have everyone believe that asthma and all the ill
health of kids are blamed on smoking. But I don't think there are many today
that smoke around their kids, do you? The Health Department has embedded guilt
in responsible adults so deep that they don't DARE smoke around their kids.
I'm sick of this War on the Smokers and I sure am sick of TRUTH and all the
Partnership for a Tobacco Free Coalition across the U.S. (I need a cigarette
to calm down...........)
34
posted on 01/03/2004 11:47:00 AM PST by
SheLion
(Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
The vet that I use for my dog even has a sign on the wall saying that smoking
is bad for pets.Try to explain that to my 12 year old Sheltie who was preceded
by another Sheltie who lasted 15 years.(Of course they were both non- smokers
so the antis would say that's why they lived so long)
I've said it before,we are living in a world gone mad with junk science.
Source: OSHA
http://www.osha-slc.gov/FedReg_osha_data/FED19940405.html
A wide variety of substances are emitted by building construction materials
and interior furnishings, appliances, office equipment, and supplies, human
activities, and biological agents.
For example, formaldehyde is emitted from various wood products, including
particle board, plywood, pressed-wood, paneling, some carpeting and backing,
some furniture and dyed materials, urea-formaldehyde insulating foam, some
cleaners and deodorizers, and from press textiles. Volatile organic compounds,
including alkanes, aromatic hydrocarbons, esters, alcohols, aldehydes, and
ketones are emitted from solvents and cleaning compounds, paints, glues,
caulks, and resins, spray propellants, fabric softeners and deodorizers,
unvented combustion sources, dry-cleaning fluids, arts and crafts, some
fabrics and furnishings,
stored gasoline, cooking, building and roofing materials, waxes and polishing
compounds, pens and markers, binders and plasticizers. Pesticides also contain
a variety of toxic organic compounds.
Building materials are point sources of emissions that include a variety of
VOCs (Table
III-1).
Some of these materials have been linked to indoor air quality problems.
The probability of a source emitting contaminants is related to the age of the
material. The newer the material, the higher the potential for emitting
contaminants. These materials include adhesives, carpeting, caulks, glazing
compounds, and paints [Ex. 4-33]. These materials, as well as
furnishings can act as a sponge or sink in which VOCs are absorbed and then
re-emitted later.
Appliances, office equipment, and supplies can emit VOCs and also
particulates [Ex.
4-33]. Table III-2 lists the many contaminants that can be emitted from these
point sources.
There is an indirect relationship between the age of the point source and the
potential rate of
contaminant emission [Ex. 4-33].
It goes on to list all the "evils" in our home.
37
posted on 01/03/2004 12:02:15 PM PST by
SheLion
(Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
The vet that I use for my dog even has a sign on the wall saying that
smoking is bad for pets.Try to explain that to my 12 year old Sheltie who was
preceded by another Sheltie who lasted 15 years.(Of course they were both non-
smokers so the antis would say that's why they lived so long)
Oh yes! The Coalition of PAID Anti's have gotten to the medical society,
that's for sure.
I always have pets in my home. Mostly cats. But they ALL live well past 14
years old. And they are indoor cats. In the summer, I might take them in the
yard on a leash, but not that much. They are completely indoor pets. None of
them wheeze and cough and have watery eyes, not ever.
What does THAT tell you?
And before Ralph died recently, there was always at least two smokers in
this house. My daughter smokes, and SHE smoked in this house before she got
married. So, that was THREE smokers in this house. Never bothered our beloved
pets one bit.
Just another saga for the War On The Smokers.
40
posted on 01/03/2004 12:08:55 PM PST by
SheLion
(Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
This theory is not as wacky as it sounds. Take vaccines for example: A vaccine
is simply the very disease you want to innoculate yourself from - only in a
small amount. For example, a smallpox vaccination consists of a small dose of
smallpox itself. The body is thus able to handle this small dose and develop
resistance to it so that a full-blown case further down the road is avoided.
42
posted on 01/03/2004 12:12:11 PM PST by
SamAdams76
And many of these toxins are in buildings where you can't even open a window
and have to breathe re-circulated air all day.
Here's another thing I will tell you: I was a Travel Agent when Northwest,
in all their glory, was the first airline to go smoke free and proud of it.
That opened the door to the rest of the airlines being forced into going smoke
free............now the AIRPORTS are smoke free.
Well, Northwest said that their FILTERS in the PLANES were FILTHY from the
smoke. After a few years, one brave soul came forward and said that THEY ARE
STILL FILTHY! That re-circulated air is just full of pollutants.
Why? Because when the airlines went smoke free, they thought they didn't
have to change the filters as much. Heh! And people are breathing in that
foul, bacteria laden air, and all the non-smokers think that the air in planes
are just fine, because gee whiz................NO ONE IS SMOKING. Wake UP
people! SARS ANYONE?
43
posted on 01/03/2004 12:13:42 PM PST by
SheLion
(Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
My daughter smokes & she has 2 indoor cats. When she lights up one cats eyes
water & the other cat doesn't. Like I have been telling ya She, we are all
different.
Offices can make you sick, according to the British Allergy Foundation.
A survey by NOP found at least 40% of office workers have symptoms which
have been linked to sick building syndrome, such as sore eyes and throats,
headaches and tiredness.
Many workers would put those symptoms down to the stress of poring over a
complex report.
45
posted on 01/03/2004 12:17:01 PM PST by
SheLion
(Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
Not only are the airlines not changing filters as often but they have cut down
on the actual circulation of fresh air since smoking was prohibited.
As a result people are more like to get diseases. Talk about throwing out the
baby with the bathwater. I'd rather put up with a smokey atmosphere than
contract TB,than you very much.
My daughter smokes & she has 2 indoor cats. When she lights up one cats
eyes water & the other cat doesn't. Like I have been telling ya She, we are
all different.
My daughter and son-in-law smoke. But since they had the
baby, they go outside on their balcony to smoke. They have three cats. The one
cat always had watery eyes. And it hasn't let up the past two years since they
have been smoking on the balcony. I dunno............I guess there is an
argument to everything.
47
posted on 01/03/2004 12:23:17 PM PST by
SheLion
(Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
As a result people are more like to get diseases. Talk about throwing out
the baby with the bathwater. I'd rather put up with a smokey atmosphere than
contract TB,than you very much.
"THEY" say that smoking is the root of
ALL evils. Well, I think people are finding out that this just isn't true.
48
posted on 01/03/2004 12:25:28 PM PST by
SheLion
(Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
THE WORLD HAS BEEN
CHEATED BY THE ANTI-TOBACCO CARTEL
USA Federal Court Judge Osteens Rulings
THE DAMNING DECISION
Here is the whole US Federal Court decision. This decision makes liars of
all those "professionals" who have exposed themselves by stating that ETS
hurts children and adults. It severely questions the integrity of our
institutions, and those ministries and department of health who have promoted
smoking bans, and manipulated the public opinion into the perception that
"smokers are killers". It accuses politicians, health activists, certain
doctors, and whoever else has engaged in the persecution of smokers of being
corrupted. The anti-smoking cartel has been officially stamped with the truth.
But this will not deter it from proceeding with its agenda of repression and
deceit. In fact, the cartel has already announced that this decision will not
alter its agenda.
When exposed for what it is, the cartel shows no modesty, but it even
accelerates the suppression of liberties and its criminal promotion of deceit
for as long as it is not stopped by the force of those who are the oppressed.
THE TEXT OF THE DECISION OF THE US FEDERAL COURT ON THE CONCLUSIONS OF
THE EPA
"EPA publicly committed to a conclusion before research has begun; excluded
industry by violating the [Radon] Act's procedural requirements; adjusted
established procedure and scientific norms to validate the agencies public
conclusion, and aggressively used the Act's authority to disseminate findings
to establish a de facto regulatory scheme intended to restrict Plaintiff's
products and to influence public opinion" "The Court is faced with the ugly
possibility that EPA adopted a methodology for each chapter, without
explanation, based on the outcome sought in that chapter"
"The Court is disturbed that EPA and Kenneth Brown [one of the EPA report's
authors] buttress the bioplausibility theory with epidemiological studies.
EPA's theory must be independently plausible"
JUDGE OSTEEN'S ORDER
Judge Osteen granted Plaintiff's (the tobacco industry's) motion for
partial summary judgement, ordering that Chapter 1 to Chapter 6 and appendices
in the EPA's "Respiratory Health Effects of Passive Smoking: Lung Cancer and
Other Disorders," (December 1992), be vacated. According to Black's Law,
Fourth Edition, the term "vacated" means:
To annul; to set aside; to cancel or rescind; to render an act void; as, to
vacate an entry or record, or a judgement.
In layman's terms, Chapters 1 to 6 and appendices to that 1992 EPA
secondhand smoke report no longer exist. Therefore, the following conclusions,
as taken verbatim from Chapter 1, page 1, of the report, do not exist, and
must be disregarded:
THE EPA STATED:
("1.1 Major Conclusions:") THE US FEDERAL COURT RULED:
"Based on the weight of the available scientific evidence, the U.S.
Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) has concluded that the widespread
exposure to environmental tobacco smoke (ETS) presents a serious and
substantial public health impact." VACATED
In adults: "ETS is a human lung carcinogen responsible for approximately
3,000 lung cancer deaths annually in the U.S. nonsmokers." VACATED
In children: "ETS exposure is casually associated with an increased risk of
lower respiratory tract infections LRIs) such as bronchitis and pneumonia.
This report estimates that 150,000 to 300,000 cases annually in infants and
young children up to 18 months of age are attributed to ETS." VACATED
"ETS exposure in casually associated with increased prevalence of fluid in
the middle ear, symptoms of upper respiratory tract irritation, and small but
significant reduction in lung function." VACATED
"ETS exposure is casually associated with additional episodes and increased
severity of symptoms in children with asthma. This report estimates that
200,000 to 1,000,000 asthmatic children have their condition worsened by
exposure to ETS." VACATED
"ETS exposure is a risk factor for new cases of asthma in children who have
not previously displayed symptoms." VACATED
################################
USA Federal Court Judge Osteen's Decision. The EPA ETS Fraud. (1998)
The full 93-page
decision document is a synopsis of that decision. This judge vacated all
the EPA scientific findings on ETS as fraud and lies and states that passive
smoking is not a carcinogen. Vacated means that the science involved no longer
exists. The antis are still using this unavailable struck down bullshit
against the smoker and the media lets them. WHY???
The decision accuses politicians, health Nazis, certain doctors, and
whoever else has engaged in the persecution of smokers of being corrupt. In
other words this learned and respected judge is informing you dumbass
reporters that anti-smokers lie their bloody pants off, but is this
newsworthy, hell no, you lot just keep taking the crap off the antis with no
investigation into its being factual and print it. Are you a bunch of
spineless jellyfish? Why are you frightened to go against the health Nazis? If
I as a factory worker can see through the crap why cant you??
I need say no more about this decision it speaks volumes for itself, take
the time to find the full court transcript and ask yourself why this was not
the biggest news story of the 20th century. ANTI-SMOKING CARTELS AND HEALTH
ACTIVIST, GOVERNMENT LIED. The general public and even the smoker have been
lied to and brainwashed on this subject through the media for so long now that
they believe anything they hear because they never or rarely hear anything
pro-smoking. Like the juror on the latest 173billion dollar lawsuit in the
state believed that a smoker couldn't get throat cancer any other way but from
his smoking, his work didn't matter and now anything the tobacco industry says
is seen as a lie without any research into the matter. If you smoke by
association that is what you die of. It's a lie a damned lie and there are
many scientists and doctors who would back me up on that.
And the anti-smoking lies go on as they still try to tell whoever is silly
enough to listen that Judge Osteen did not deal with asthma and ETS. Bloody
lying bastards!!!!!
Joy Faulkner
50
posted on 01/03/2004 12:31:33 PM PST by
SheLion
(Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those
of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free
Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by
copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.
I kept an article from our
local newspaper, May 31, 2003, entitled "Want healthy children? Let 'em eat
a little dirt." It's hypothesis is that "early childhood exposure to dirty
conditions, including bacteria and other disease-causing germs is important
for normal development of the immune system."
Speaking for myself and my family, I think there's some validity to this
theory. I remember one day when my daughter (then 2) picked up and ate a
rolly-polly bug while playing in the front yard! That happened only once, and
of course we discouraged her from repeating the "game." Both of my children
are now college freshmen and have seldom been sick. (She has more problems
with monthly cramps than with any illness.)
Conversely, those peers of my children who received drugs and/or
doctor-visits for every minor cold, cut or problem seem to have developed more
allergies and/or tendancy toward illness as adults.
I believe there's something to be said for this theory that exposure to
"dirty conditions, including bacteria" during childhood does go a long way
toward building up the immune system of that person in adulthood!
52
posted on 01/03/2004 12:35:21 PM PST by
Prov3456
Cigarette smoke causes me to have an asthma attack, nothing else that I
encounter does that. Most people don't have that reaction. Even some
asthmatics aren't effected by tobacco smoke, other things set them off. I have
2 dogs on my lap right now, my best friend can't even come in my house she is
so allergic to dogs. We are all different.
This is an interesting thread. I'm a smoker, too, but that's not the problem.
The problem is every winter as soon as the (oil) heat kicks on, my nose dries
up inside and starts to hurt. And it hurts until April.
"I tend to agree with your assessment. Most of the younger people I meet
get ghastly allergic to anything and everything under the sun. A consequence
of too much protection from things in the world when kids are young, I
postulate."
go
HERE and read a short article about "homegrown vaccines."
61
posted on 01/03/2004 1:01:02 PM PST by
redhead
(Les Français sont des singes de capitulation qui mangent du fromage.)
"Just read your post about your sister-in-law. What a way to live! She will
drive herself and her kids crazy if she doesn't lighten up. Too much use of
anti bacterials are proving to be harmful."
I thought I read somewhere
that they are beginning to realize that all these germicides being overused so
constantly is becoming a problem, and people are being sensitized to the
chemicals used to kill the bacteria.
62
posted on 01/03/2004 1:05:33 PM PST by
redhead
(Les Français sont des singes de capitulation qui mangent du fromage.)
I thought I read somewhere that they are beginning to realize that all
these germicides being overused so constantly is becoming a problem, and
people are being sensitized to the chemicals used to kill the bacteria.
I worked with a young fellow who was always sick, and was rather obsessed with
germs and what not. Turns out he was constantly on prescription drugs like
penecillin. He was diagnosed with a full-body yeast infection.
My son was constantly sick as a baby, and the doctor kept prescribing
amoxycillin for anything and everything he said he had. I pressured my wife to
switch doctors and not take the kid in every time he sniffled. After going
through a bout of something without medical assistance the kid never got sick
as frequently again.
You and I are in the same boat, except I heat with wood in a big wood
furnace in the basement with an oil furnace for back-up. I, too, sneeze at
times. I used to have a humidifier but ran out of room for it.
That seemed to help. I also keep the filters in both furnace changed often.
They get really filthy. Especially the wood furnace one.
I think it's because we are inside a closed house and the dry heat the
furnaces put out plays hell with our sinuses. It's horrible, I know. I am just
now getting over a terrible sinus infection.
And if anyone has ever had one of those, they know the pain and misery they
cause.
I never had sinus problems until we moved into this house and started
heating with oil and wood. Before we moved to Maine, we had central heating.
EVERYWHERE. oh well.
65
posted on 01/03/2004 1:22:27 PM PST by
SheLion
(Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
Thanks for your reply. I also have a humidifier, and an air cleaner, but the
only thing that helps is being outdoors (not too practical in January) or
standing in the shower. I guess it's just the lack of moisture in the air,
even with the humidifier.
Oh! I forgot about those! I, too, have several HEPA air cleaners in all the
rooms downstairs and one upstairs. Still doesn't do any good. This wood heat
is very dirty. I have to dust everyday, so can you imagine the air I am
breathing?
Then, in the summer, with the windows open, I am breathing in the
clouds of pesticide that the farmers put on the fields. I have three fields
around my house. Wonder how I am still alive. hehe!
70
posted on 01/03/2004 1:53:54 PM PST by
SheLion
(Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
Here's one for you guys....I didn't start smoking till I was 25, I had my
first baby at 18, and my husband was a non-smoker also. I went thru broncial
asthma (?) with this child till he was old enough to decide he was going to
smoke himself, he was turned down on enlistment because of the lung problems.
Now he is 30 and enlisting this week for the army, asthma went away when he
took up smoking and now he can enlist...rofl. Its all BS and nothing more than
a money grab, people have gotten so paranoid and stupid its ridiculous.
The seat belt law drives me insane, I went to jail for 24 hrs. instead of
paying the fine which the judge reducted it from 108.00 to 15.00, I still
wouldn't pay. If everyone did that instead of just mailing a check in and tied
up the court system, that little law wouldn't last long either.
No one is willing to fight anymore, they keep chinking away at our freedoms on
a day to day basis, all in the name of safety and concern. WAKE UP AMERICA
before its to late.
71
posted on 01/03/2004 2:09:12 PM PST by
BriarBey
No...you need more moisture in the air. Summers are more humid and keep your
nose from drying and cracking inside, go buy a humidifier or when its really
hurting, put a pan of water on the stove, bring it to a boil, throw a towel
over your head with the pan and breath the steam. It will make it feel better.
I'm sure your nose looks like the cracked desert on the inside....lol.
72
posted on 01/03/2004 2:13:35 PM PST by
BriarBey
Look at it from a Darwinian perspective: we're adapted to a dirty environment.
Cave people, hunter-gatherers, early farmers were considerably dirtier than we
are. There have only been a few cultures that even bathed regularly (Greece,
Rome, Japan, some American Indians), or had anything apporoaching modern
public hygeine.
It's only been the last 150 or so years that there has even been a germ
theory of disease - before then, cleanliness was an aesthetic (or in some
cases ritualistic) mattter.
Also, if things like eating dirt were *really* bad, they'd have been
selected out a long time ago.
I was always miserable with the forced air heat we had in Delaware, I always
kept a window open and pans of water on top of the floor vents for some
moisture. And that was natural gas.
Now we have the opposite problem. We have an oil fired furnace but it fuels a
baseboard hot water heating system. There is too much moisture in the house so
we wound up with mold and all of us were sick for more than a month before we
found and eradicated the major source of the mold. We are also firing up the
wood stove a little more often in order to dry things out.
My husband and I spent the 3 days after Christmas smelling like clorox and
lysol but by Monday we all felt better than we had since before Thanksgiving.
And yesterday he spent the day pulling up the old vinyl tiles from the
bathroom floor. We've got an electric space heater going in there right now
trying to get the sub floor fully dried so that we can put in ceramic tile.
I'm clean - but I'm not a fanatic such as an earlier post described an SIL.
One of my daughter's favorite past times is creating mud puddles and making
mud pies!!!! She is rarely sick, and even when she does get sick, she's over
it within a day or two.
75
posted on 01/03/2004 5:09:36 PM PST by
Gabz
(smoke gnatzies - small minds buzzing in your business -swat'em)
You know, it might be worth it for me to move to a place that had hot water
heating - it beats having your nose hurt five months a year. Any other
drawbacks (besides the mold)?
There really are no drawbacks to it, at all. It keeps moisture in the air and
is very effecient. The heat is not what caused the mold, although it didn't
help in getting rid of it. I'm sorry if I gave that impression
Where we live there is a very high humidity factor and we've had a horrendous
amount of rain since September, nothing is drying and the ground is thoroughly
saturated.
There was a tremendous amount of mold build up on the outside of the house and
my husband went through 4 gallons of bleach getting rid of it. It actually
looks like he put a new coat of paint on it. So between the exterior mold, the
high humidity, all the rain, the dampness under the vinyl tile in the bathroom
and the hot water heating system - we had a major problem.
Actually there is one drawback to this type of heating system - you most
likely would have to buy a much older house or have one custom built. Our
house was built in 1945 but the heating system was installed later - it's an
old farmhouse that used to beheated with a woodstove. I think the baseboard
hot water systems became popular in the early 60s.
77
posted on 01/03/2004 5:38:05 PM PST by
Gabz
(smoke gnatzies - small minds buzzing in your business -swat'em)
Always happy to help out a fellow FReeper. I would never have survived the
ordeal of moving if it wasn't for my FReeper "family" aso I try to return the
favor whenever possible!!!!
79
posted on 01/03/2004 6:20:37 PM PST by
Gabz
(smoke gnatzies - small minds buzzing in your business -swat'em)
As far as the boomers go,they don't think they will ever be gone because of
their good living habits. Aren't they all going to live forever?
<Shiver> Don't even say that, Even as a joke </Chill down the back of my
spine>
But no they a'int going to live forever, Past Generations did things to
extend their lives like discover antibiotics, vaccines for polio and the
erradication of smallpox while today Boomer Scientist instead spend their time
coming up with things like Viagra, Prozac, Ritlin, a gazillion different types
of antacids and of course all these silly junk studies.
It's too late for the baby boomers they goofed and wasted their limited
time on trivial nonsense like how smokers children stand up in shopping carts
and whether french fries are addictive or not when they should have been
trying to find cures for things that will actually kill them like cancer.
86
posted on 01/04/2004 5:06:17 PM PST by
qam1
(@Generation X Ping list - Freep me to be added and see my home page for
details)
Public choice theory demonstrates why looking to
government to fix things can often lead to more harm than good, as
one of its leading architects and Nobel laureate James M. Buchanan
explains
Public choice should be understood as a research programme rather
than a discipline or even a sub-discipline of economics. Its
origins date to the mid-20th century, and viewed retrospectively,
the theoretical 'gap' in political economy that it emerged to fill
seems so large that its development seems to have been inevitable.
Nations
emerging from World War II, including the Western democracies,
were allocating between one-third and one-half of their total
product through political institutions rather than through
markets. Economists, however, were devoting their efforts almost
exclusively to understanding and explaining the market sector. My
own modest first entry into the subject matter, in 1949, was
little more than a call for those economists who examined taxes
and spending to pay some attention to empirical reality, and thus
to politics.
Initially,
the work of economists in this area raised serious doubts about
the political process. Working simultaneously, but independently,
Kenneth Arrow and Duncan Black proved that democracy, interpreted
as majority rule, could not work to promote any general or public
interest. The now-famous 'impossibility theorem', as published in
Arrow's book Social Choice and Individual Values (1951),
stimulated an extended discussion. What Arrow and Black had in
fact done was to discover or rediscover the phenomenon of
'majority cycles', whereby election results rotate in continuous
cycles with no equilibrium or stopping point. The suggestion of
this analysis was that majoritarian democracy is inherently
unstable.
I entered
this discussion with a generalised critique of the analysis
generated by the Arrow-Black approach. Aren't 'majority cycles'
the most desirable outcome of a democratic process? After all, any
attainment of political equilibrium via majority rule would amount
to the permanent imposition of the majority's will on the outvoted
minority. Would not a guaranteed rotation of outcomes be
preferable, enabling the members of the minority in one round of
voting to come back in subsequent rounds and ascend to majority
membership? My concern, then and later, was the prevention of
discrimination against minorities rather than stability of
political outcomes. The question, from an economist's perspective,
was how to obtain a combination of efficiency and justice under
majority rule.
Wicksell's insight
The great Swedish economist Knut Wicksell was the most important
of all precursory figures in public choice. In his dissertation,
published in 1896, he was concerned about both the injustice and
the inefficiency resulting from unfettered majority rule in
parliamentary assemblies. Majority rule seemed quite likely to
impose net costs or damages on large segments of the citizen or
taxpayer group. Why should members of such minorities, facing
discrimination, lend their support to democratic political
structures? Unless all groups can benefit from the ultimate
exchange with government, how can overall stability be maintained?
These
considerations led Wicksell to question the efficacy of majority
rule itself. His solution to the problem was to propose that
majority rule be modified in the direction of unanimity. If the
agreement of all persons in the voting group is required to
implement collective action, it would guarantee that all persons
secure net gains and, further, that the approved actions would
yield benefits in excess of costs. Of course, Wicksell recognised
that, if applied in a literal voting setting, a requirement of
unanimity would produce stalemate. To recognise this, however,
does not diminish the value of the unanimity rule as a benchmark
for comparative evaluation. In suggestions for practical
constitutional reforms, Wicksell supported changes in voting rules
from simple to qualified or super majorities, for example, a
requirement of five-sixths approval for collective proposals.
In their
analyses, Black and Arrow had assumed, more or less implicitly,
that the choices to be voted on exist prior to, and outside of,
the decision-making process itself. Wicksell understood the error
in this assumption, although he did not recognise the importance
of this insight. Neither did Gordon Tullock, who wrote a seminal
paper in 1959 using the example of farmer voters, each of whom
wants to have his local road repaired with costs borne by the
whole community. Tullock showed that majority rule allows for
coalitions of such farmers to generate election results that
impose unjust costs on the whole community while producing
inefficiently large outlays on local roads.
If majority
rule produces unjust and inefficient outcomes, and if political
stability is secured only by discrimination against minorities,
how can democracy, as the organising principle for political
structure, possibly claim normative legitimacy? Wicksell's
criterion for achieving justice and efficiency in collective
action-the shift from majority rule toward unanimity-seems
institutionally impractical. But without some such reform, how
could taxpayers be assured that their participation in the
democracy would yield net benefits?
Constitutional economics
In implicit response to these questions, Tullock and I commenced
to work on what was to become The Calculus of Consent, published
in 1962. The central contribution of this book was to identify a
two-level structure of collective decision-making. We
distinguished between 'ordinary politics', consisting of decisions
made in legislative assemblies, and 'constitutional politics',
consisting of decisions made about the rules for ordinary
politics.
We were
not, of course, inventing this distinction. Both in legal theory
and in practice, constitutional law had long been distinguished
from statute law. What we did was to bring this distinction into
economic analysis. Doing so allowed us to answer the questions
posed previously: From the perspective of both justice and
efficiency, majority rule may safely be allowed to operate in the
realm of ordinary politics provided that there is generalised
consensus on the constitution, or on the rules that define and
limit what can be done through ordinary politics. It is in
arriving at this constitutional framework where Wicksell's idea of
requiring unanimity-or at least super majorities-may be
practically incorporated.
In a sense,
the analysis in our book could have been interpreted as a
formalisation of the structure that James Madison and his
colleagues had in mind when they constructed the American
Constitution. At the least, it offered a substantive criticism of
the then-dominant elevation of unfettered majority rule to
sacrosanct status in political science.
Our book
was widely well received, which prompted Tullock and me, who were
then at the University of Virginia, to initiate and organise a
small research conference in April 1963. We brought together
economists, political scientists, sociologists and scholars from
other disciplines, all of whom were engaged in research outside
the boundaries of their disciplines. The discussion was
sufficiently stimulating to motivate the formation of an
organisation which we first called the Committee on Non-Market
Decision-Making, and to initiate plans for a journal to be called
Papers on Non-Market Decision-Making.
We were
unhappy with these awkward labels, and after several meetings
there emerged the new name 'public choice', both for the
organisation and the journal. In this way the Public Choice
Society and the journal Public Choice came into being. Both have
proved to be quite successful as institutional embodiments of the
research programme, and sister organisations and journals have
since been set up in Europe and Asia.
Many
sub-programmes have emerged from the umbrella of public choice.
One in particular deserves mention-'rent seeking', a sub-programme
initiated in a paper by Tullock in 1967, and christened with this
title by Anne Krueger in 1974. Its central idea emerges from the
natural mindset of the economist, whose understanding and
explanation of human interaction depends critically on predictable
responses to measurable incentives. In essence, it extends the
idea of the profit motive from the economic sphere to the sphere
of collective action. It presupposes that if there is value to be
gained through politics, persons will invest resources in efforts
to capture this value. It also demonstrates how this investment is
wasteful in an aggregate-value sense.
Tullock's
early treatment of rent seeking was concentrated on monopoly,
tariffs and theft, but the list could be almost indefinitely
expanded. If the government is empowered to grant monopoly rights
or tariff protection to one group, at the expense of the general
public or of designated losers, it follows that potential
beneficiaries will compete for the prize. And since only one group
can be rewarded, the resources invested by other groups-which
could have been used to produce valued goods and services-are
wasted. Given this basic insight, much of modern politics can be
understood as rent-seeking activity. Pork-barrel politics is only
the most obvious example. Much of the growth of the bureaucratic
or regulatory sector of government can best be explained in terms
of the competition between political agents for constituency
support through the use of promises of discriminatory transfers of
wealth.
As noted,
the primary contribution of The Calculus of Consent was to
distinguish two levels of collective action, ordinary or
day-to-day politics and constitutional politics. Indeed, the
subtitle of that book was 'Logical Foundations of Constitutional
Democracy'. Clearly, political action takes place at two distinct
levels, one within the existing set of rules or constitution, the
other establishing the rules or constitution that impose limits on
subsequent actions.
Only recently have economists broken away from the presumption
that constraints on choices are always imposed from the outside.
Recent research has involved the choice of constraints, even on
the behavior of persons in non-collective settings, for instance,
with regard to drug or gambling addiction. But even beyond that,
what I have called the 'constitutional way of thinking' shifts
attention to the framework rules of political order-the rules that
secure consensus among members of the body politic. It is at this
level that individuals calculate their terms of exchange with the
state or with political authority. They may well calculate that
they are better off for their membership in the constitutional
order, even while assessing the impact of ordinary political
actions to be contrary to their interests.
A somewhat loose way of putting this is to say that in a
constitutional democracy, persons owe loyalty to the constitution
rather than to the government. I have long argued that on
precisely this point, American public attitudes are quite
different from those in Europe.
Objections to public choice
There is a familiar criticism of public choice theory to the
effect that it is ideologically biased. In comparing and analysing
alternative sets of constitutional rules, both those in existence
and those that might be introduced prospectively, how does public
choice theory, as such, remain neutral in the scientific sense?
Here it is
necessary to appreciate the prevailing mindset of social
scientists and philosophers at the midpoint of the 20th century
when public choice arose. The socialist ideology was pervasive,
and was supported by the allegedly neutral research programme
called 'theoretical welfare economics', which concentrated on
identifying the failures of observed markets to meet idealised
standards. In sum, this branch of inquiry offered theories of
market failure. But failure in comparison with what? The implicit
presumption was always that politicised corrections for market
failures would work perfectly. In other words, market failures
were set against an idealised politics.
Public
choice then came along and provided analyses of the behavior of
persons acting politically, whether voters, politicians or
bureaucrats. These analyses exposed the essentially false
comparisons that were then informing so much of both scientific
and public opinion. In a very real sense, public choice became a
set of theories of governmental failures, as an offset to the
theories of market failures that had previously emerged from
theoretical welfare economics. Or, as I put it in the title of a
lecture in Vienna in 1978, public choice may be summarised by the
three-word description, 'politics without romance'.
The public
choice research programme is better seen as a correction of the
scientific record than as the introduction of an anti-governmental
ideology. Regardless of any ideological bias, exposure to public
choice analysis necessarily brings a more critical attitude toward
politicised nostrums to alleged socioeconomic problems. Public
choice almost literally forces the critic to be pragmatic in
comparing alternative constitutional arrangements, disallowing any
presumption that bureaucratic corrections for market failures will
accomplish the desired objectives.
A more
provocative criticism of public choice centres on the claim that
it is immoral. The source of this charge lies in the application
to politics of the assumption that individuals in the marketplace
behave in a self-interested way. More specifically, economic
models of behaviour include net wealth, an externally measurable
variable, as an important 'good' that individuals seek to
maximise. The moral condemnation of public choice is centred on
the presumed transference of this element of economic theory to
political analysis. Critics argue that people acting politically
-for example, as voters or as legislators-do not behave as they do
in markets. Individuals are differently motivated when they are
choosing 'for the public' rather than for themselves in private
choice capacities. Or so the criticism runs.
At base,
this criticism stems from a misunderstanding that may have been
fostered by the failure of economists to acknowledge the limits of
their efforts. The economic model of behaviour, even if restricted
to market activity, should never be taken to provide the be-all
and end-all of scientific explanation. Persons act from many
motives, and the economic model concentrates attention only on one
of the many possible forces behind actions. Economists do, of
course, presume that the 'goods' they employ in their models for
predicting behaviour are relatively important. And in fact, the
hypothesis that promised shifts in net wealth modify political
behaviour in predictable ways has not been readily falsifiable
empirically.
Public
choice, as an inclusive research programme, incorporates the
presumption that persons do not readily become economic eunuchs as
they shift from market to political participation. Those who
respond predictably to ordinary incentives in the marketplace do
not fail to respond at all when they act as citizens. The public
choice theorist should, of course, acknowledge that the strength
and predictive power of the strict economic model of behaviour is
somewhat mitigated as the shift is made from private market to
collective choice. Persons in political roles may, indeed, act to
a degree in terms of what they consider to be the general
interest. Such acknowledgment does not, however, in any way imply
that the basic explanatory model loses all of its predictive
potential, or that ordinary incentives no longer matter.
Impact of public choice
Public choice theory has developed and matured over the course of
a full half-century. It is useful to assess the impact and effects
of this programme, both on thinking in the scientific community
and in the formation of public attitudes. By simple comparison
with the climate of opinion in 1950, both the punditry and the
public are more critical of politics and politicians, more cynical
about the motivations of political action, and less naive in
thinking that political nostrums offer easy solutions to social
problems. And this shift in attitudes extends well beyond the loss
of belief in the efficacy of socialism, a loss of belief grounded
both in historical regime failures and in the collapse of
intellectually idealised structures.
As I noted
earlier, when we look back at the scientific and public climates
of discussion 50 years ago, the prevailing mindset was socialist
in its underlying presupposition that government offered the
solution to social problems. But there was a confusing amalgam of
Marxism and ideal political theory involved: Governments, as
observed, were modelled and condemned by Marxists as furthering
class interests, but governments which might be installed 'after
the revolution', so to speak, would become both omniscient and
benevolent.
In some of
their implicit modelling of political behavior aimed at furthering
special group or class interests, the Marxists seemed to be closet
associates of public choice, even as they rejected methodological
individualism. But how was the basic Marxist critique of politics,
as observed, to be transformed into the idealised politics of the
benevolent and omniscient superstate? This question was simply
left glaringly unanswered. And the debates of the 1930s were
considered by confused economists of the time to have been won by
the socialists rather than by their opponents, Ludwig von Mises
and Friedrich Hayek. Both sides, to an extent, neglected the
relevance of incentives in motivating human action, including
political action.
The
structure of ideas that was adduced in support of the emerging
Leviathan welfare state was logically flawed and could have been
maintained only through long-continued illusion. But,
interestingly, the failure, in whole or in part, of the socialist
structure of ideas did not come from within the academy. Mises and
Hayek were not successful in their early efforts, and classical
liberalism seemed to be at its nadir at mid-century. Failure came,
not from a collapse of an intellectually defunct structure of
ideas, but from the cumulative record of non-performance in the
implementation of extended collectivist schemes-non-performance
measured against promised claims, something that could be observed
directly. In other words, governments everywhere overreached. They
tried to do more than the institutional framework would support.
This record of failure, both in the socialist and welfare states,
came to be recognised widely, commencing in the 1960s and
accelerating in the 1970s.
Where is
the influence of public choice in this history? I do not claim
that it dislodged the prevailing socialist mindset in the
academies, and that this intellectual shift then exerted feedback
on political reality. What I do claim is that public choice
exerted major influence in providing a coherent understanding and
interpretation of what could be everywhere observed. The public
directly sensed that collectivistic schemes were failing, that
politicisation did not offer the promised correctives for any and
all social ills, that governmental intrusions often made things
worse rather than better. How could these direct observations be
fitted into a satisfactory understanding?
Public
choice came along and offered a foundation for such an
understanding. Armed with nothing more than the rudimentary
insights from public choice, persons could understand why, once
established, bureaucracies tend to grow apparently without limit
and without connection to initially promised functions. They could
understand why pork-barrel politics dominated the attention of
legislators; why there seems to be a direct relationship between
the overall size of government and the investment in efforts to
secure special concessions from government (rent seeking); why the
tax system is described by the increasing number of special
credits, exemptions, and loopholes; why balanced budgets are so
hard to secure; and why strategically placed industries secure
tariff protection.
A version
of the old fable about the king's nakedness may be helpful here.
Public choice is like the small boy who said that the king really
has no clothes. Once he said this, everyone recognised that the
king's nakedness had been recognised, but that no-one had really
called attention to this fact.
Let us be
careful not to claim too much, however. Public choice did not
emerge from some profoundly new insight, some new discovery, some
social science miracle. Public choice, in its basic insights into
the workings of politics, incorporates an understanding of human
nature that differs little, if at all, from that of James Madison
and his colleagues at the time of the American Founding. The
essential wisdom of the 18th century, of Adam Smith and classical
political economy and of the American Founders, was lost through
two centuries of intellectual folly. Public choice does little
more than incorporate a rediscovery of this wisdom and its
implications into economic analyses of modern politics.
The
Author
James M. Buchanan, winner of the 1986 Alfred Nobel
Memorial Prize in Economic Sciences, is Distinguished Professor
Emeritus of Economics at George Mason University. He is best known
for developing the 'public choice theory' of economics. Reprinted
from Imprimis (March 2003), the national speech digest of
Hillsdale College (www.hillsdale.edu)
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88
posted on 01/05/2004 4:46:20 AM PST by
Leisler
(Bored? Short of cash? Go to a Dean "Meetin". It is free, freaky and you'll
laugh your butt off.)
It do sound familiar. Maybe we need a grant to do research. They send us a
barrel of money. We sit on it for a while. Then publish what we already know
and spend the money.
CG
89
posted on 01/05/2004 4:53:07 AM PST by
Conspiracy Guy (No words were harmed during the production of this
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Tiny doses of some toxins may make body stronger, theory says
advertisement
Knight Ridder Newspapers
Feb. 27, 2004 06:45 AM
WASHINGTON - Tiny doses of toxins and radiation in the environment, once seen
as insignificant, affect people's health in good and bad ways, scientists are
finding.
In some cases - such as most types of radiation and cancer-causing dioxin -
tiny exposures may benefit people, according to a scientific theory that's
becoming more widely accepted.
In other cases - such as lead and tiny particles of soot - new research
indicates that doses once considered insignificant sometimes make people sick.
If these findings seem to be confusing, that's because toxicologists are still
trying to understand them. Whether small doses of toxins are beneficial or
harmful seems to depend on what the substances are, how small the doses are,
what diseases are being studied and who's exposed to them.
But toxicologists agree that small doses of toxic substances do matter.
Findings in this developing science could dramatically change how society
weighs the risks of pollution and environmental and public health regulations.
It will also affect thinking about which pollution poses the greatest health
threats.
"A little arsenic, dioxin or radiation peppered on the spaghetti sauce may be
just what we require to live long and healthy lives," reads a somewhat
tongue-in-cheek article posted in January by the Science & Environment Policy
Project.
"And since humans need more toxins in our environment than allowed under
current government regulations, so the theory goes, future efforts to clean up
the environment could be greatly reduced."
SEPP is an advocacy group that fights mainstream scientists' claims about the
existence of global warming.
"The real question is what is happening at low doses as opposed to what is
happening at high doses," Linda Birnbaum, the Environmental Protection
Agency's director of experimental toxicology and the incoming president of the
Society of Toxicology, said this week.
A National Academy of Sciences study on the health effects of low-level
radiation - including possible beneficial effects - is due late this year.
It's expected to give the most comprehensive and independent look to date at
small-dose issues.
Edward Calabrese, a toxicology professor at the University of Massachusetts in
Amherst, is the driving force behind the new look at the effects of small
doses of toxic chemicals. The once-discredited theory, called hormesis, is
making its way into mainstream science and will be a central topic at next
month's Society of Toxicology conference in Baltimore.
"You have (low doses of toxins and radiation) that could be used for good,
something that could be used for bad, maybe both at the same time," said
Calabrese, a researcher who's on several government scientific advisory
boards.
The idea behind hormesis is that parts of human cells change when challenged
with small doses of toxins. These changes often make the cell stronger at
first, until it's overwhelmed by larger doses. It's similar to the
immunity-building effects produced by small and weakened doses of viruses used
in vaccines, Calabrese said.
With the help of a $900,000 U.S. Air Force contract, he's developed a database
of 6,000 studies that he says show hormesis effects.
Some, Calabrese says, show that low levels of dioxin - a group of
cancer-causing chemicals that are byproducts of burning and industrial
activities - reduce liver tumors. Other studies suggest health benefits from
low doses of non-radon radiation.
Calabrese once was the bane of polluting industries, showing that single doses
of certain chemicals can cause cancer. Now polluters use his theories to make
the case for reduced pollution regulations.
Calabrese says that oversimplifies his position because he believes that low
doses are beneficial in some cases and harmful in others.
"The blanket statement that low doses can be helpful is wrong," said Peter
deFur, an environmental studies professor at Virginia Commonwealth University
who serves on the EPA's chemical advisory board. "There's no evidence to
support that what's actually happening is actually good for you."
Birnbaum said Calabrese's work fails to examine at other side effects. It
doesn't look at how small doses of some toxins can accumulate in a body. And,
she said, it doesn't take into account the way different toxins in the body
interact in new and harmful ways.
Calabrese acknowledges these limitations.
"The idea that low doses of things may have a good effect is something we have
to be very, very careful about," Birnbaum said.
"Hormesis has been considered a fringe theory for decades," said Dr. Gina
Solomon, a physician and senior scientist at the environmental advocacy group
Natural Resources Defense Council. "It's been used to justify widespread
exposure to toxic chemicals and radiation."
In a 2003 scientific journal, Calabrese said his research should be used to
change environmental regulations and attitudes toward toxins in a way "not
unlike changing from a Soviet-style society to a Western one."
Environmental activists are worried because Calabrese's theories have the ear
of the top regulatory official in the Bush administration. John Graham,
director of the White House's Office of Information and Regulatory Analysis,
had been on the board of directors of an organization that Calabrese set up to
promote hormesis research. Asked by e-mail why he thought the research was
important. Graham declined to comment, saying he hasn't been following the
issue since he joined the administration in 2001.
Birnbaum and deFur cautioned that adverse health effects also come from low
doses of toxins, and should be taken into account in regulations and chemical
thresholds.
They pointed to research indicating that lead at levels previously thought to
be acceptable are proving harmful to child development. Other recent studies
also show that tinier-than-regulated amounts of soot in the air cause asthma,
a chronic lung condition, Birnbaum said.
New research also shows that small amounts of estrogen and other endocrine
system developers are causing fish kills in the nation's rivers, deFur said.
---
For more information, check out the Web site for Calabrese's group, Biologic
Effects of Low Level Exposures at the University of Massachusetts at:
http://www.belleonline.com